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Post by D.Ram on Apr 20, 2016 4:57:45 GMT
Hello all! Back after a long break In Enpi, just before the jump, we stand in kiba while doing what I assume is a bo-grab. In Kanku Sho too, two steps before a similar jump, we encounter the same(?) position. My doubt - are the hands doing the same move in both of these? ______________ More sweat in training, less blood in battle
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Post by Bob Davis on Apr 20, 2016 8:47:54 GMT
To which the answer has to be...possibly It's all about the context of the posture, what comes before, what comes after and what defensive (or offensive) position you find yourself in (in my opinion, obviously ). If you are looking at a performance kata then the Bo catch paints a pretty picture in your head. If you are looking at application then forget the Bo. Ask yourself a logical question, assuming the (highly unlikely) fact that you've survived a full power Bo strike well enough to have blocked it with your hands and then disarmed your opponent you then discard the weapon (which gives you a major advantage) and go straight back to empty hand techniques, why would you do that?
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Post by D.Ram on Apr 22, 2016 4:15:13 GMT
You UK Sensei's always go into Bunkai! :-D My query was purely regarding the stance - looking at videos (Kanazawa, and specifically for K.Sho there's a good one by Ohta Sensei) - I was still not clear whether that one-hand-up-one-hand-down stance was the SAME in both Enpi and K.Sho - wanted clarity on whether it was indeed the same. Bunkai-wise, i'm fully with you - at least in K.Sho we poke our opponent once before throwing away the Bo, while in Enpi I am not sure why we would jump after getting a Bo - unless, perhaps, the message is that we Karateka are not expected to know how to use the Bo at all, and so having it in hand may harm US more than the opponent ______________ More sweat in training, less blood in battle
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Post by Bob Davis on Apr 22, 2016 10:30:37 GMT
No, I suspect that's just me (it's the world I move in), there are still plenty of UK instructors doing "real" karate BTW, you started the bunkai thing with the "Bo grab" (what's that if not an application? ) To answer the actual question then, no, the hand positions are not identical (at least according to Kanazawa's kata books).
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Post by jimlukelkc on May 1, 2016 21:11:46 GMT
Unfortunately Deepak the context is important to understand the movement but in isolation, the hands make a 'wheeling' motion. Think of the left hand pulling and the right hand lifting. However Bob is correct, both movements are not the same. I still think you would find the movement easier to visualise and understand if you studied the application.
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Post by th0mas on May 5, 2016 12:06:31 GMT
To Ram... Why not focus on the bunkai or fighting principles? Else what is the point?
K.Sho could potentially be a kata designed with developing fighting principles against an armed opponent, I do not think Empi is though (my opinion and my interpretation... So take it or leave it)
The problem with the motion to which you refer in K.Sho ( if memory serves ... I haven't gone back and checked) is often interpreted as a defence against a bo staff as your opponent attacks, which as others have pointed out, is not realistic and certainly a low probability application.
Think range... If you close in on someone with a bo, to limit their wind up, then logically the next step is to grab and disarm... This I think is the most likely application in this instance. For Empi a scoot, lift and throw seems the most likely application.
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