|
Post by bryceifleming on Mar 18, 2012 16:57:35 GMT
"Subsequently the EKF felt unable to join another meeting unless all groups agreed to conform to the WKF statues and resign from all other World bodes"
Here is a quote lifted from a news article about the ongoing effort to create a single governing body for karate in GB. It could be anywhere in the world because ignorance and arrogance reigns supreme.
In this case you have four groups that want to meet somewhere in the middle, compromise to some degree and co-operate to some degree. One group is saying: "Oh yes, lets do that, but here is the catch: all you useless turds have to compromise by abandoning everything you are doing now and do just our stuff". How very reasonable.
I have watched tapes of WKF karate: good stuff, but not appreciably so different from all the other karate out there that there cannot be some middle ground. One simple compromise might be to agree to disagree and admit that there are other worthwhile views in this world. Maybe there is room enough in karate for many views that still co-operate for big things like Olympic recognition. Or we can just continue telling the other guy to roll over a die because only MY style should represent karate.
This sort of tunnel vision is what makes followers of fringe splinter groups into blood thirsty terrorists: inability to tolerate the existence of any view contrary to your own.
|
|
|
Post by malk103 on Mar 18, 2012 17:23:02 GMT
I've been following this as our club is a member of the AMA, I don't know much about the politics higher up but we get some great guidance from the AMA, it also means that we can have their insurance and support, all of our grades are registered so you can rock up to "most" other clubs and associations and train, compete or attend courses - this aspect I find the best. They also have some excellent "mature" policies that help to protect us and our students. Part of me wants to have 1 big umbrella org that we can all belong to and share the core values, I also think it would be good to cross over with training and knowledge. I think more this way as there are 2 clubs near us that have gone it alone, all they can ever teach their students is what they know, if there are any problems then there is no support, the Sensei's word is final - even if its wrong or they are the problem. I'm not sure how people would feel about having to join an org/assoc by law to be able to run a club but personally I think it would be a good thing - based on what I know and can see. To have one org would surely be a benifit - anyone looking in from the outside must think the Karate world is mad and that every group/org/assoc/style just seems to split every few years and create another one. So long as the styles were allowed to remain then clubs could stick to a style that they prefer or assist in the gradual evolution of it.
Until people can sort out their differences and provide the Karate world something worth having then politics can remain at the Dojo door and like minded Karateka will just get on with it!
|
|
|
Post by Bob Davis on Mar 18, 2012 18:26:14 GMT
Only really taking a contrary position for the sake of debate Or, you could equally well say that because they have gone it alone they now have total freedom to get in outside help and learning from what ever source they like without being constrained by the limitations imposed by their organisation and there may actually be more opportunities with them than with being part of a group. If like minded karateka are ignoring the politics and are "just getting on with it" then what value does an organisation actually add and why do we need to wait for them to offer something "worth having"? Should we not just move on and leave them behind?
|
|
|
Post by malk103 on Mar 18, 2012 20:23:04 GMT
Good points Bob, the 2 local clubs I was thinking of are single Black belts going it alone, we have had students from the Karate club and niether could produce or get proof of member to member insurance and their technique was below average with a few glaringly obvious bad habits. The TKD club are also alone and he hands out belts like sweets, they will only realise if they have been training properly if they go to another club that has been. I dare say that they both have a code of conduct and good ethics but its only their say so, they have no up to date policies to follow and no reporting line if they are at fault - the AMA has all of this. Also if we want to swap and change clubs or go off to national courses then most other orgs will take us, or we can transfer insurance etc. I think we have good enough freedom, I have heard horror stories of people being asked to leave semina's because they didn't belong to a certain org etc. I only have limited experience with all of this though..... I like your second point, maybe its up to all clubs and individuals to tell these organisations what WE want them to provide and see if they can align our needs?
|
|
|
Post by bryceifleming on Mar 19, 2012 3:58:35 GMT
Malk: For some reason I have seen a fair bit of politics. I have seen a couple of association melt downs and by any number of bizarre twists of fate I have been privy to some of the private machinations of some of the bigger blow-outs that have occurred in Canada. Hell, at one point I was the pawn that started the blow out that led to the disintegration of our provincial association, which predictably accelerated the disintegration of the national association. I felt wonderful to know that I was used and yet I was never even given the opportunity to grade beyond Shodan.
Politics are rarely or never about valid technical or philosophical issues: they are about personal gripes and bruised egos. And some degree of racism.
Lets look at what makes associations of some value: 1. Organizing tournaments. 2. Organizing camps 3. Organizing seminars. and, maybe, setting technical standards, but I am not so sure about that.
The technical standards should be set by the school, not an association. Thus, if you claim to teach Nishiyama-ryu (or Asai-ryu) Shotokan karate, then you have to meet those standards and adhere to the technical standards of that school. If that school sponsors competitions organized under their rules and you attend those tournaments, then you play by those rules. But a school of thought is not an association.
The flip side are associations. Organize, administrate, but never dictate. I mean, look at seminars: who the hell cares who attends what as long as the dues are paid to support the seminar? Same thing goes for competitons: if the competitor pays his entry fees and adheres to the rules OF THE DAY, then who the heck cares who is doing what? We don't let our boss or our government dictate to us what we do in our free time (our wives are a whole different matter), so why do we let a bunch of over-the-hill jocks limit our karate experience?
We keep on acting like karate is some sort of religion and some of us are acting like the most dogmatic religious fundamentalists anywhere. How about we all just roll over, get stupid and start believing the world is flat and cavemen hunted dinosaurs.
|
|
|
Post by fujicolt on Mar 20, 2012 0:32:31 GMT
Sadly Gentlemen - it is all about Money, Power and Control no matter what they disguise it as. by personal experience and by choosing NOT to worry about their sad rules and control freak attitudes I have shown - for a very long time now - that if you create an opportunity for Karateka to come together with No interest in their political allegences and you lay down the following rules: - Please bring your Gi, a good attitude and an open mind =
you will again and again see them behave in a way that is inspiring to see, a joy to be part of and most wonderfully void of division and politics as they ALL train together with immense effort and spirit and then become friends!
The divisions in Karate are a disgrace but will remain so because it has never been a democratically controlled activity and is therefore in a mess as those 'in power' impose their individual requirements (money, power and control) upon it all!
Sad but true!
|
|
|
Post by kensei on Mar 20, 2012 13:56:49 GMT
As the chair for our local group, I get to see tones of politics that bounce about, the key...Dont care! I train because I like it, I train in the style I do because I love it, I train with my instructor because I respect and enjoy training with him. If someone told me that I could not train in Karate again (because of politics) I would say something rude, grab my gi and go train my arse off. As for power, money and greed...that is someone elses issue, I train because I love it...no one got truely rich from training...not money wise at least My Advice to those tied up in political issues...Shut up and train!
|
|
|
Post by Bob Davis on Mar 20, 2012 14:35:40 GMT
I think James sort of summed it up, "don't care". If we all worked that way then orgs would only exist because they had something of value to offer. Unfortunatley a lot of people still like to point the finger if you're not wearing the right "school tie" (this isn't peculiar to karate, just human nature : and judge themselves against others by badge or affiliation, not by skill, knowledge or attitude. How does the new student starting out pick the right place to train? You could argue that this is part of the point of orgs, to offer a defined and consistant set of standards and a reliable place to train. Unfortunatley there are enough "well known" orgs out there offering a shonkey product (just set up as money makers) so that's no guarentee that you'll be better off than training with an independant. All we can do as individuals is guard ourselves against falling into the "badge" trap, not point fingers, and keep an open mind about what others do until we've seen it up close ourselves.
|
|
|
Post by fujicolt on Mar 21, 2012 6:00:16 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Bob Davis on Mar 21, 2012 10:09:40 GMT
I'll put it on the "to do" list
|
|
|
Post by fujicolt on Mar 21, 2012 12:45:58 GMT
'To Do' is that some kind of Ninja style were you ram your toes into your opponents orifices? - sorry too much oromorph today LMAO! (Would really appreciate it though if you did contribute to the article section - am sure it would be an informative read for those who haven't yet ventured outside of thier 'comfort zone' to quote a certain B. Davis
|
|
|
Post by Bob Davis on Mar 21, 2012 13:10:02 GMT
If I were to own up to the fact that it wouldn't be the first time would that be too much information? (Maybe leave that for a different article, or even a different forum )
|
|
|
Post by fujicolt on Mar 21, 2012 13:16:14 GMT
The 'urge' to write an inappropriate response is becoming overwhelming Bob - so i'll go make a cuppa instead LMAO!
|
|