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Post by jimlukelkc on Mar 20, 2011 19:10:49 GMT
Just wondering, after looking at quite high graded karate-ka performing entire kata bunkai, do you view kata like a story board, ?as in, you start the kata, you are attacked ( often it would appear, from the side ), you block and counter, you are attacked, ( often it would appear from the other side ), you block and counter, you go on to be attacked from another direction etc. , or do you see it another way? Is it more complex and clever than that? I realise ( Steve ) we can never give an absolute answer to this as it is impossible to know definitively, but I think we can infer certain things just by testing them either way and judging for our-selves which makes the most sense. any thoughts?
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Post by kensei on Mar 22, 2011 12:35:41 GMT
I am not going to put a English play write in my answer, so I hope everyone forgives me ;D
First off I dont think of Bunkai or Kata as being Story boards. it think of them more as sets of captured moments in time that are all placed together to develop skills for self protection. IN other words I dont think that a Kata is like a fight, I think its more like a set of fight set ups that we are introduced to that all kind of follow a theme!
I would never say that someone got into a fight and then put the resulting moves together and came up with Empi or Hangetsu or even Chinte. I think that the "authors" of the Katas had ideas on how to use specific techniques and set about to teach them in the most practicle way they could at the time. And each movement set is a suggestion of what to do according to an instructor at a set moment...and many things can be drawn from those moments, one move has many interpretations.
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Post by jimlukelkc on Mar 22, 2011 15:24:35 GMT
I am not going to put a English play write in my answer, so I hope everyone forgives me ;D First off I dont think of Bunkai or Kata as being Story boards. it think of them more as sets of captured moments in time that are all placed together to develop skills for self protection. IN other words I dont think that a Kata is like a fight, I think its more like a set of fight set ups that we are introduced to that all kind of follow a theme! Theme! that, to my mind is the key here. If we assume ( and we do have to make some assumptions as we can never "know") that each kata has a theme, then we will be closer to understanding if we can judge what that theme is. Many of get caught up in the bunkai of advanced kata but the heians make the point beautifully. First assumption: the kata is teaching us a combative principle. Second assumption: We will always be facing out opponent. Third assumption: We are not responding to a specific attack. Fourth assumption: When practising solo kata the turning, lets say 90 degrees, to face our opponent means the technique requires us to be 90 degrees to our opponent not that is where the attack is originating. So for instance in Heian ni-dan, when practising with an uke, we would start facing him, finish sideways on. another example is after the opening sequence of that kata when the attack seems to come from behind, is the kata actually indicating this is where you should be in relation to your opponent? This would make more sense as it is difficult to indicate uke position otherwise. Any thoughts?
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Post by fujicolt on Mar 23, 2011 11:19:53 GMT
Just wondering, after looking at quite high graded karate-ka performing entire kata bunkai, do you view kata like a story board, ?as in, you start the kata, you are attacked ( often it would appear, from the side ), you block and counter, you are attacked, ( often it would appear from the other side ), you block and counter, you go on to be attacked from another direction etc. , or do you see it another way? Is it more complex and clever than that? I realise ( Steve ) we can never give an absolute answer to this as it is impossible to know definitively, but I think we can infer certain things just by testing them either way and judging for our-selves which makes the most sense. any thoughts? James, I DID really laugh out loud by the way you neatly shut me up before i even got going. Perfect timing Sir HAHA! However, in doing so you gave the absolute Answer by saying.... we can never give an absolute answer to this as it is impossible to know definitively, but I think we can infer certain things just by testing them either way and judging for our-selves which makes the most sense. On a personal level I tend to adjust my mindset to fit what i am trying to gain from the Kata practice at that given point and this, as i know you are aware, can vary immensely. However, when i am particularly focusing on applying the moves to imaginary adversaries I 'think' 98% of the moves to be close-quarter or nearer - which, having seen one of your Kata Implications classes I suspect you would concur with. A neat little 'make it feel more real' exercise if you are ever training in a hall that has those 'Stacking chairs' available for you to use = Do the Kata Slowly and as you track the embusen have people place chairs all around you so that they do not block any channel or avenue of the Embusen but are close enough for you to have to be very conscious of them and thus perform the Unsoku (footwork and strategic movement/transitions) very precisely to avoid hitting any of them. Try it and it really does make you feel like you are fighting in a Bar rather than having a scrap in the middle of a clear, polished floor and well lit 'room'. - especially so if you are able to dim the lighting as you KNOW that if you follow the Embusen you will not crash into any furniture BUT you must follow it very precisely or its chaos - not dissimilar to having to work around the 'landscape' of a violent encounter! Do remember though that you will have to slightly adjust the layout of the furniture to accomodate peoples different physiques and thus stance lengths etc. Have fun!
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Post by jimlukelkc on Mar 23, 2011 18:51:29 GMT
You know me Steve I always have fun! Will give it a go as for "shutting you up" I am all in favour of the pre-emptive strike lol !
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