Anyone do Kobudo?

[fleur]

I know the majority of people on this site are Shotokan and not alot of Shotokan schools do kobudo, but I know that some do.

Just wondering if anyone else on this site does Kobudo and if so what they practise and from what lineage have they decided to adopt.

I know that Funakoshi did study bo under Arakaki Seisho and kobudo was carried over to Japan pre WWII but post war to prevent the complete shut down of karate practise by the Japan Army authorities (who saw the practise as a threat to military authority), Masatoshi Nakayama assured authorities that Kobudo (weapons practise) would be holted and the empty hand practise was simply a healthy physical sport that posed no threat. Nakayama managed to convince authorities and saved his beloved karate but from that point on kobudo in Shotokan holted.

My question now is: I know some schools have now sort out this part of their lost past and I am wondering if any of the Shotokan schools involved in this forum have rekindled their historic kobudo fire?

As my club does kobudo, I'm just curious?

[tomobrien]

We do kobudo but we are not a pure Shotokan style club!

Thanks,
Tom

[fujicolt]

Hey Fleur

Whilst I can only really comment on the UK (but i believe you will find similar around the world) I think you will find that IF a Shotokan Karateka does study Kubudo they will be doing so elsewhere OR thier Instructor had, as a personal choice studied it elsewhere.

Coincidently i have just written a chapter from the book where i describe how in my past i very seriously considered a deep study of Kobudo. I fortunately had been introduced to it via one of my Instructors : Steve Cattle and he had sought out Kobudo to better help him understand Kata. you will have to read the book to fully understand and know my conclusions BUT I can say this:

I became very aware that there is a very positive synergystic positive gain if Karateka study Kobudo or Kobudoka Study Karate IF they have enough time to study both deeply.

However I am also in agreement with the belif that 'You cannot chase two rabbits!'

I think in Shotokan Dojo you would find only about 1 or 0.5% of karateka actively studying Kobudo. If you do it will often be studied elsewhere.

hope that helps Fleur X

[fleur]

Thanks Steve, yeah I didn't think many did, thats why I inquired.

Tom, what kobudo do you do? Which weapons and do you know from what style you are engaging in?

[malk103]

Is there anywhere to find out more about it? Any decent online resources maybe.

I don't want to chase another rabbit but wouldn't mind looking just out of curiosity. I guess traditionally they would have been farm tools?

[fujicolt]

Fleur may be able to help Mal - in the meantime just type Kobudo into your search engine and fill yer boots ;D

[deckerdude304]

Hya fleur, decker here. Tis not something i would do in my Maritial Arts Training to be honest! I'm dangerous enough with a brolly on a windy day, let alone Tonfa's, Sai or Nunchaku's, and as for big swords, it just wouldn't be good!!
Big up to the people who DO practise with weaponry though, AND in the hands of experts too.
i have seen many video's of classes using all sorts in class drills, awesome really but not for me i'm afraid!

[jimlukelkc]

I have done a little Iaido, Tekku Tonfa, Nunchaku ( real, not flashy, for the camera stuff) and Okinawan Bo and Jo.

[jimlukelkc]

Sorry just re-read your post Fleur. Yes some were farm implements as in the Kama. The Tonfa I believe was the central handle from a mill stone ( but don't quote me on that one) The nunchaku were originally a kind of horse-bridle, not a rice-flail as is often quoted and the Tekku were used for gathering in fishermen's nets.

[fleur]

Great Jim & Tom, nice to see some others into it also.

I do bo, sai and kama - pretty badly tho ;D

I have been doing bo for just over a year, sai for around 8 months and have just been introduced to kama.

Here is a link to the kobudo section of our website, which shows lineage and some cool old photos of the masters whom our affiliated dojo in Okinawa learnt from. We are very fortunate to be affiliated with Kodokan Taira dojo which is renowned for it's kobudo expertise. Both my Sensei's Plaisted & Herlihy are featured on this page. There is also some links to a few videos (in blue) of bo kihon and of my Sensei's preforming a few of the bo katas. Some Sai kihon is soon to be added.

I am fortunate that Herlihy Sensei is an extremely competent, skilled, passionate and patient kobudoka and I am one of only three senior students that he works with to do kobudo.

www.karate-kobudo.co.nz/Kobudo.html

[kensei]

Have dabbled a bit, but nothing serious...would love to play more with it but seriously dont have the time.

As for Farm tools, I dont think so. The Tonfa was fashioned after the billy club used by Chinese police in mainland china, the Sai was made up like the Jutte that the Okinawan/Chinese/ and Japanese civil police used, the Kama was a chinese weapon...no clue if it was a farm tool before that however...and most of the weapons used were not of original Okinawan.

Its much like the BS that Karate came from farmers defending themselves against Samurai....no!

[fleur]

Steve, I don't believe doing kobudo and karate are the chasing of two different rabbits.

Kobudo (I believe) is an extention of your existing karate skills. People that do kobudo already have the foundation and fundamentals of karate. The stances in our kobudo system are the same stances in our karate. A strike is still a strike and block is still a block and a sweep is a sweep. Hip movement is just as important as empty hand. Nothing in that respect changes. As my Sensei says when correcting - stances, strikes and hip movement "Same, same" constantly referring our karate fundamentals.

Our kata's are just as an empty hand kata but with the extention of weapon.

Our school only lets people start their kobudo training once they have a good rounding in their karate established as this is essential before you can add on. And not everyone choses to do the kobudo. It's personal. Some find their karate enough or simply aren't interested in it. The choose is up to the individual.

Doing kobudo and empty hand is a challenge time wise, that is true, but if you develop a passion for it as I have the rewards are worth it.

[fujicolt]

Fleur - totally get your point and great that you are getting so much from it.

I have to disagree on the two rabbits bit UNLESS one has sufficient time to devote to each (similar) but VERY different Arts.

In a world where I am unlikely to carry or have access to a weapon I chose to specialise in what Funakoshi called the 'Total Weapon' and hone the many weapons my body provides and that i will have instantly at my disposal. that - in itself - is 'Quote: A lifetime of study no matter how long you live' Nakayama - but totally respect (and considered it very deeply myself) anyone that studies both 'rabbits'

Maybe you are more of a greyhound than I Fleur - actually I have been described as more PitBull Like! HAHA!

Seriously Fleur it is fantastic that you are enjoying both so much and i am sure you can help people here whom wish to do the same!

H

[kensei]

Having dipped my toes into several arts I can say that YES they can help you out with your study of Karate....However if you want to master both...I fear its a hard and time consuming venture.

Having gained my black belt in Judo and tried a few other arts for long stints I can say that yes my karate has been improved by learning different things, but to be frank, even my old black belt in Judo pretty much means little tome at this point, with out up keep my skills in Judo have basically just enhanced my understanding in Karate and I would fear I wouldnt not be much good in a Judo match!...if you let me kick and punch first however I might have a "fighting chance"

Point being a bit of a looksee into weapons training may prove to provide a few lessons for me in Karate, but I would not have the time to become better at it than that.

[fujicolt]

two rabbits - James you have just succinctly summed up what i mean!

[andyupton]

I have two pair of nunchaku, a bokken and a pair of Sai, but I've never studied them properley, just sort of messed around with them really ! ;D
How many of us have various weapons we have just "messed around" with ?

[genkaimade]

Jan 8, 2012 9:43:33 GMT andyupton said:

I have two pair of nunchaku, a bokken and a pair of Sai, but I've never studied them properley, just sort of messed around with them really ! ;D
How many of us have various weapons we have just "messed around" with ?

I do indeed occasionally play around with a bokken that has taken up residence in my cupboard!